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"ENN Election Platforms Chat — Foreign Affairs"Welcome to ENN's Political Chat, where we talk about the nitty-gritty issues that impact Europeia.
Today is the first installment in a series that breaks down the candidates' platform. Keeping most the emphasis on policy, we try to help voters cut through the multi-thousand word platforms with thousand word content of our own!
The transcript below has been lightly edited. After the introduction, GraVandius did not participate in the foreign policy topics, but will be featured tomorrow in the domestic policy chat.
HEM (HEM Tiberius, ENN Publisher):
Hello everyone, welcome to ENN's August 2017 platform chat!!!!
Festavo (Senator):
I'm only here so I don't get fined.
Kylia Quilor (Grand Admiral):
who are you on the forums?
Festavo:
I'm uh...I'm Brunhilde. Yep that is it.
HEM:
Okay so guys, basically we are going to compare and contrast the three platforms based on policy area. (i.e. Foreign Affairs, Navy, Interior etc.). We will discuss "Euroworks" in the context of Interior for the record, since the other tickets don't necessarily have an equivalent section.
HEM:
Might be good to open each platform in a tab.
Festavo:
Yeah I need to do that. Honestly I never read snowball's fully. I don't see him as a serious candidate.
GraVandius:
Are we even going to bother with snowball?
Festavo:
It's a race between Brun and Cat imho.
HEM:
No last minute surge for Fox / Verteger?
Festavo:
No platform yet and I just don't see him pulling it off.
Kylia Quilor:
I doubt it. Verteger is not going to do Leo any favors.
HEM:
Also the name change really threw me.
Festavo:
He doesn't have the accomplishments and likely won't have anything else to offer that either cat or Brun cannot offer
GraVandius:
No they're the old forgotten candidate ticket that goes nowhere.
HEM:
Maybe I'm just out of it, but I was like "who is this..."
Festavo:
I knew he would run. He just does not stand a chance in this landscape.
He is a more serious contender than Snowball but that is not saying much.
Kylia Quilor:
The most Leo could do is with Snowball siphon just enough votes to force a runoff — and even then, I doubt it.
HEM:
Right, I think that's likely actually.
Festavo:
A runoff is likely imho. I see it as a tight race between cat and Brun. I'm still undecided personally.
HEM:
I am too.
Kylia Quilor:
I want to vote Brun, but I have some misgivings about her FA instincts. I LOVE that she wants to leave CAIN, but she was a key figure in getting us into it, so...
Festavo:
Honestly I was leaning towards Cat until Brun said Cat would be the Grand Admiral so now I am leaning towards Brun. I really liked Cat's military section, so if she is going to handle military for Brun then...
Kylia Quilor:
Cat's nomination does count for a lot with me when it comes to Brun's platform...some of what she said made me worry she had someone far more off the wall in mind than Cat.
GraVandius:
I'm still very much undecided. I wish I could combine the good ideas of the two.
HEM:
Cool, if we are all ready, let's start with Foreign Affairs. While the focus is ideally on the policy in the platforms, we can slip in some political horserace talk too - will keep it interesting.
Kylia Quilor:
Well, I like that Cat wants to make more a shift to the UCRs than Brun.
Festavo:
I was gonna say...
Kylia Quilor:
I'm always a proponent of a more UCR-leaning Foreign Policy. Don't ignore the GCRs, but they aren't the whole Gameplay world.
Festavo:
Honesty, I am glad Brunhilde dropped the GCR Awards idea. It did not seem like it is our place and I don't think it would have helped us.
HEM:
Right that seemed like a really bad idea.
Festavo:
I wouldn't say really bad. It just seemed...not worth it
HEM:
Do you think that people are impressed with her humility in dropping it, or do they see it as a stumble?
Kylia Quilor:
Bad idea, bad optics, waste of resources all around. It was a stumble to have it, but she gets points for appreciating that it wasn't a good idea.
Festavo:
She is a risk taker and I appreciate her taking a step outside the box. It was a miscalculation instead of a stumble.
Kylia Quilor:
Cat's plans are a lot more technically minded on FA too.
Festavo:
Her plans are very detailed
Kylia Quilor:
What with her plans for revamping the foreign service, training, etc, etc with EO2 and all that jazz? Which I like in theory, but am not sure she can pull off as well as she thinks. Cat's got a very ambitious platform...
Festavo:
I may have some minor nuances where I disagree with her approach on some things, but Cat has a very solid and detailed FA platform. However, I dislike her decision to exclude the WAD from the cabinet.
Kylia Quilor:
Brun's is more down to earth. Well, given who the WAD is, I'm thrilled about it. But then, we all know how I feel about Aex's election
Festavo:
I personally feel that the WAD should be the MOWA.
Kylia Quilor:
If the WAD is MoWA, then the WAD shouldn't be elected.
HEM:
I feel like Cat's EO2 plan is basically what we've done with ambassadors for ten years, but we are finally embracing it for what it is, and distributing Standard articles instead of foreign updates? (standard / EBC since they are merged)
Festavo:
You can argue over how the WAD should be decided, but at the end of the day it just does not make sense for the WAD and the MOWA to be separate individuals.
Kylia Quilor:
Well it doesn't really make sense to have a MoWA.
Festavo:
That is definitely a valid argument.
Kylia Quilor:
Ish. Her intent sounds like she wants to try and make the EO2 people far more on that front of the, "Be active in your assigned regions."
Festavo:
I am open to how to go about it, but the end goal should be one person to handle the WA. This is something I believe Brunhilde gets right and Cat gets wrong.
Kylia Quilor:
Yeah, well, I can't see Aex effectively doing the job of MoWA
Festavo:
We'll just have to see if Brunhilde wins.
Kylia Quilor:
His Presidency was incredibly hands off and he barely did anything to direct me or... you know, even imply that he existed, most of the time. His actual record when he holds office isn't the same as his record when he gets it. But now we're off topic.
Festavo:
I'd say Brunhilde's is solid and more approachable and flexible while Cat's is more detailed and thought out.
Both have good FA platforms in my honest opinion. No real major disagreements that I have with them.
Kylia Quilor:
I like that Both of them have strong notions of Gameplay Outreach, because Europeia has been very silent in GP, and we really shouldn't have that be a thing.
Festavo:
Gameplay Outreach is a big deal and something that should not (and will not it seems) go neglected.
HEM:
I think it's interesting that Brunhilde's emphasis is GCR when some of our biggest successes in FA the last term were with UCRs
Maybe she intends that as a course correction, but it stuck out to me.
Festavo:
I don't find it surprising to be honest. She is going for the big dogs in Gameplay. The entrenched regions that are not going anywhere.
Kylia Quilor:
I think she does see it as that.
Festavo:
I think it should be a more balanced approach, but I can understand where she is coming from.
Kylia Quilor:
Cat's notions on Gameplay Outreach seem a little bit more useful too, on this read through.
Festavo:
I just hope she does not intend to neglect the UCR element of foreign affairs though.
Kylia Quilor:
I think that mucking around in the GCRs has been a problem we've kept doing. We've gotten our dicks burned in the GCRs as often as we've had serious gains out of it, it feels like at some point, maybe we stop doing that so much?
HEM:
Right. How much time did we spend building relationships with NPO and TSP? Over the last four years?
Festavo:
In my opinion, Europeia is like a light heavyweight trying to box in the heavyweight (GCR) division. It can definitely work because we are pretty damn close to being a heavyweight, but we just aren't the real deal. It depends who you fight (or work with in this case).
HEM:
I resist that characterization because I feel like 50% of the time at least two of the feeders are inactive shells. Maybe I'm not fully looped in on the times now, though.
Kylia Quilor:
The GCRs are heavyweights, but a lot of them have glass jaws or punches.
Festavo:
That is why I said it depends who you fight, HEM
Kylia Quilor:
When you actually go onto their forums, nowhere near as active as their size should imply; and of course, they're a lot more politically dysfunctional — the NPO and TRR notwithstanding
Festavo:
We are smaller in size than a region like Osiris, but we have more endorsements on our delegate for instance. We also kill them in activity iirc, So they weigh more, but we can punch harder and faster.
HEM:
Right. They will be here until the game dies though. So I get your heavyweight comment.
Festavo:
Yes exactly. They are entrenched.
Kylia Quilor:
Europeia will probably be here until the game dies too, though. I feel like I'm the only major semi-major gameplayer that doesn't dream of retiring to the GCRs
Festavo:
They are like Manny Pacquaio if he were a Heavyweight. He has slipped a lot in recent times, but people still love him and he will still get big name fights as long as he wants.
Kylia Quilor:
I think Europeia needs to rebuild our sphere in the UCRs before we go back to the GCRs though. With UIAF and TNI dead, and Albion... barely a thing in FA or Military, we don't have as deep a bench to draw on for help when we need it as we used to.
Festavo:
I think it can be a balanced effort.
HEM:
Yeah the more I think about it, I really don't like Brun's GCR emphasis
Kylia Quilor:
The treaties with the UK and KGB and so one are a step in the right track to rebuilding that deep bench. So that next time we really need to get into a GCR, we can ask them for support, call in favors, etc
Festavo:
I think Europeia would be served well to build relations with more UCRs, but I also don't think we should give up on GCRs right now. I don't understand why it can't be a balanced or multi faceted approach.
HEM:
Pivoting us to a slightly different topic: all three candidates seem to recognize that CAIN is in trouble.
Kylia Quilor:
True.
@Festavo Its a matter of resources
Festavo:
I think every gameplayer not under a rock recognized that CAIN is in trouble.
Kylia Quilor:
The problem is that two of them think we can fix it. And... I mean, how?
Festavo:
It makes sense to leave CAIN. There is nothing more to be gained from staying and even Brunhilde recognizes that.
HEM:
I was wondering when it was going to be mentioned in Europeia. I got the sense that people were hoping it would just quietly vanish.
Festavo:
It essentially has. It exists, but it isn't something that you can see, feel, or touch at the moment.
Kylia Quilor:
Europeia doesn't want to admit that CAIN failed. But I also do think that people were afraid of the blowback.
Festavo:
CAIN has failed and it isn't the fault of any one person.
Kylia Quilor:
Its the fault of the regions chose to create it, and I think they made some poor managerial decisions up front in terms of how to handle Nazi Collaborator regions too heavy-handed up front, created a scenario where they dug in rather than reconsider.
Festavo:
The most notable thing that caused CAIN's decline is Brunhilde's temporary retirement (which was out of her control of course).
Kylia Quilor:
And then there was Femdom Empire. TGW got CAIN into a mess it didn't need to be in
Festavo:
I don't see a need for CAIN anymore. Ruining Nazi Sandcastles is doing a fine job of taking care of the anti-fascist operations.
HEM:
Is it a good look to cede that to them though?
Festavo:
I understand how important perception is, but sometimes you just have to admit when something has failed or is no longer useful. It's time to admit that and move on.
Kylia Quilor:
Is it a good look to be clinging to a failed project? I don't think there's any good way out of CAIN at this point, but better to get out now instead of later.
HEM:
I'm just saying, not sure saying, "this other org is doing just fine!" is a great PR move
Kylia Quilor:
We don't need to say that.
Festavo:
It's the truth.
HEM:
It's the truth we deserve, but not the truth we need.
Kylia Quilor:
The truth we need is that these directed crusades never work as well as intended
Festavo:
RNS is doing exactly what CAIN was made for. If you truly care about fighting the Nazis then you have to consent to that and should accept it.
Kylia Quilor:
I mean, look how Liberate Nazi Europe played out? It kicked up a hornets nest that still hasn't died down.
If we'd left them well enough alone to begin with, they'd never have started raiding again, and that started a whole chain of things
Festavo:
That's going down a rabbit hole that I don't think we have time for here now. We've spent a lot of time on FA so let's not go too far off topic lol.
Kylia Quilor:
Fair enough
HEM:
Right. Okay, we've touched on all the big topics in FA I think.
Kylia Quilor:
I don't think there's much to say about the Navy portions, since they're so similar for Brun and Cat.
Festavo:
They are very similar.
I think Cat has a better Navy plan, but with Brun announcing Cat as her Grand Admiral pick I consider them one and the same.
Kylia Quilor:
Not exactly. The President will still direct the GA, but Brun's plans are more general than Cat's. And Brun by her own admission, doesn't know as much about the Navy as other things so... close enough
Festavo:
Brunhilde is not experienced in this area and she seems to admit that. She will likely defer to the Grand Admiral in most cases.
Kylia Quilor:
I'm ready to grade them out of FA
Festavo:
Same
HEM:
Cool, let's grade 1-10 (10 being best) with a brief explanation.
Kylia Quilor:
Brun - solid 7.5, Cat solid 7.5
Brun wants to leave CAIN, but wants to emphasize GCRs and put UCRs on the backburner or lower priority. Cat wants to swing to the UCRs a bit more but wants to stay in CAIN and I'm not 100% sold on EO2's specifics (also, the name, god, the name painful). Plus, I can't help but have some probably unreasoable misgivings about Brun's FA instincts.
Nothing I can point to, but...
Festavo:
I rate Brunhilde's as 7 out of 10. Her FA platform is solid and mostly on point, but it is more general and seems to allow more flexibility (whether that is good or bad I leave up to you). She leans heavily towards GCR outreach vs. UCR outreach so that's a manner of preference. It could be the change we need at this time. I just hope she does not neglect UCRs. She is the kind of person who isn't afraid to break from orthodoxy so I respect that and would be willing to take that risk.
I rate Cat's as an 8 out of 10. It is a very detailed and thought out plan that covers a lot of bases and shows a lot of dedication and knowledge to FA. There are some issues I have with it (such as the WAD most notably), but at the end of the day I know her platform is still progress overall. She favors the UCR leaning outreach policy we have now so I do admit I prefer that to Brun's.
HEM:
Brun: 6/10
Cat: 8/10
Snowball: 2/10
I would rate both Brun and Cat evenly, but I really don't like Brun's focus on Game-Created Regions and that's a huge part of her platform.
I think Cat's EO2 program is really over-rated — it's literally what we've always done, rebranded! But it is a coherent path forward, and hopefully the added focus / rebranding will give some more momentum.
All candidates rightly point out that things are bad news bears over at CAIN HQ, and I think both stances are both reasonable, "Let's wait and see what happens this next term..."
Check back into ENN Tomorrow, August 21st, for the Domestic Policy portion of the chat!